Fr.John Meslier’s problem of Heaven

 Fr. Meslier asks why wouldn’t it be better to have Heaven onEarth  in the first place: we would then have free will and a guarantee not to do wrong! No need exists for free will and soul-building as John Hick clamors.

 He uses the straw man of all or nothing and the slippery slope to inveigh against a better environment for us on Earth. But we rationalists find that that boomerangs on thiests, because the same would be in Heaven! Nelson Pike adumbrates many pages in ” God and Evi l” to illuminate why we would be robots had we that guarantee, but then the denizens and God Himself would be robots!

 This is  no argument of hobgoblins of little minds for consistency!

Meslier eviscerates all defenses and theodicies with this argument whislt Alvin Plantinga abjectly fails to eviscerate the logical argument from evil with his argument from ignorance of the unknown defense argument!

  To prattle that He has unknown reasons and His ways are so different from ours betrays morality and -reason! That would mean that we only think that we know right from wrong, turning morality topsy-turvy!

   To aver that God’s nature is good begs the question of His nature in order to obviate the problem for the divine command theorist to overcome Plato’s Euthyphro that either He commands what is independently  right of Him or else He could make rape right!

Thus, we rationalist objurgate all defenses and theodicies for exonerating Him of grave evils! It is incumbent upon theists then to try to overcome this devastating argument, which they cannot do!

We animals’ conditions are important whilst His onerous need for a relationship with us is nothing whatsoever!

Might does not make right!

We gnu atheists mean business!  Furthermore , where is the evidence for contra-causal free will [ free will without any cause], Heaven and Hell outside any scriptures?

 I never consider the future state! Does He exist is the question for me?

 No! That He  would be omniscient,omnibenevolent and omnipotent and permit evils entails a egregious contradiction and thus incoherency of these attributes such that He could not exist, affirming ignosticism!

 And in the Eden myth, Yahweh entraps the original two, who if free will is so important should have  had knowledge of right and wrong in order not to partake of the fruit, but then again, that tree was of entrapment as He knows beforehand what would happen! Here we the problem of our free will, and His foreknowledge of the future enters the scene of questions. Many state that He   does  indeed know what we will do but that knowledge imparts no determining of our acts.

  Viewers, please contribute to a rigorous, stimulating, spririted, significant conversation about all theis! Again, here is your chance to shine!

  ” Logic is the bane of theists.” Fr. Griggs

4 comments on “Fr.John Meslier’s problem of Heaven

  • Aaron @ Theo-sophical Ruminations takes me and other naturalists to task. He claims that we only come up with theory whilst people need action to overcome evils. He claims we give that theory as we hate God. No, that theory provides evidence agains the very existence of God, denying that people need Him to overcome evil or whatever as their own inner resouces come forth with Him only as an inspiration, crutch or placebo. We seek no going away from a non-existent being whom thus we cannot hate anyway!
    This problem of Heaven rules against all defenses and theodicies!
    No unknown reason exists for the horrors! That defense blasphemes reason and -morality and humanity, resting on the argument from ignorance!

  • What do you opine about any of this?
    Morality binds any God, and it’s not what He wants but what is good for sentient beings that counts! It is an ignoratio elenchi- beside the point- to declare why, He wants a free,loving relationship with us.
    That then bespeaks evil itself!
    We owe no God anything whatsoever whilst He’ d face that one-way street of having to have put us into a better place in the first place!
    What blasphemy against reason and -humanity are those defenses and theodicies!

  • Viewers, even Plantinga recognizes that the problem of evil tells considerably against the omni-God. What do you maintain? Do you rebut or add to Fr. Meslier’s problem of Heaven? And the continued essay about this problem beckons also.

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